Need some advise for wedding photo shoot

[mingkywingky]

Hi everyone,

My niece is getting married next month, and my sister asks me to be the photographer of the wedding. I'm not sure if my skill is good enough to do a huge job like that. I'm not good at indoor photography either. However, I have to help my sister since hiring a real photographer is very precious :D and this will be my great opportunity too, right?
I really need some advise from the experts, what should I prepare (the equipments (lenses, lighting) I'm gonna need, and what setting should I put on my camera? etc)?
This is an Indonesian wedding:
1. The wedding will be held indoor.
2. There will be a religion's wedding ceremony in the building.
3. There will be a reception party, means the bride and the groom and the parents will accept the blessing from all of guest from their kind of "king and queen" chairs on a small stage (the guest will congratulate them one by one), I should take the pictures from in front of the stage. The background of the stage will be a traditional backdropped, decorated with flowers.
4. There will be picture sessions (on the stage) of the guest and families with the bride and the groom, and the pictures of the bride and the groom themselves as well.

I will be accompanied by another amateur photographer too:o to share the job.

Thank you very much for your kind attention.

Tenny:)
Canon Rebel T1i

[shirlm2]

Hi Tenny as no one has answered you I thought I’d give some suggestions based on my one and only experience. I took some photos of a friend’s wedding as a favour as she was not having a photographer. I could not believe how stressful it was as I am not really a portrait photographer & most definitely an amateur.

I would suggest you go to the venues with some ‘models’ before hand, at the same time of day as the wedding, so you can see how the light falls, try some test shots for composition and generally sort out where you will place yourself, what settings might work best etc.

Check with the family what sort of shots they want, formal, informal, important groupings etc.

It might be an idea to have someone to help you organise the groups you want to photograph. People mill about. It’s hard work thinking of your settings, composition etc and trying to organise people. I had someone to do that & it was a huge help. If it’s more formal this might not be an issue.

I would be tempted to impress on the family that there are no guarantees and that you are doing them a favour. Even if you are fairly confident the photos will come out well you don’t want a falling out with family should something unforeseen go wrong. At least you have a back up photographer which will help a lot.

Hope this has been helpful and good luck.

[coffee]

Are you being asked to be the the wedding photographer because the couple simply can't afford to hire a pro?

Here's the reason I ask, and please take no offense to this Tenny, but if a person is asking what settings the camera should be on when doing a wedding, they really shouldn't be the front line photographer. You could certainly be a second photographer working behind the pro. Wedding are just way too important to go into it as the main photographer and only HOPING you can get the shots needed to do justice. You only get one chance to do this right.

If it's a matter of there is absolutely no way for the couple to hire a professional, and they asked you as a favor to them, I would say go for it if you feel comfortable, but at the very least, if they are friends, I would try and talked them into hiring a pro, and ask the pro if you can take some shots in the background, or even take the couple at times for yourself if it's ok.

I, myself, would never consider being the main photographer at a wedding even though I have been the second at 3 this past year. One was my niece, one was a friend, and the third is coming up in a few weeks. The one coming up, I was asked by a good friend if I would do it for them cause they could afford a pro. My friend told me they have another amateur friend lined up to do it, but since meeting me some months ago and knowing I'm into photography, they said they would rather I do it. I told them I would be delighted to be the second photographer, and to keep the other they already have lined up.

Certainly there are hundred of tips and advice a person could give you, and it may be that Jerry will come along and do just that, he's very good you know, but I think the best advice a person could give you would be to talk the couple into hiring a pro, and you could work with them if they allow it. It's just not worth the risk. I would suggest however that the couple provide disposable cameras and have on all the tables so the guest can get involved in the picture taking. Good luck Tenny.

[shirlm2]

Joseph has made some very good points & I need to add that my friend was only going to rely on photos taken by guests. She never intended having a pro at all, so mine were just an addition, but even so I felt the pressure.

[DoctorJazz]

Tenny,

You have some great advice here....I will throw in my ONE experience from a recent
wedding I attended where the bride and groom decided to forego the professional photographer and just take their chances with what they got for photos from friends and family.....when it was all done, they said it worked out great since
everyone had a slightly different perspective on the scene. It was great fun for me and I provided them with a disc of the shots that I was happy with, as did everyone else.

If they are not as relaxed about things, they would definitely need to hire a pro, as Joseph has suggested.

[coffee]

I want to clearify one suggestion I made. When I mentioned the disposable cameras on the tables, I ment during the reception, not the during the formals. Just from the table cameras we laid out for the reception, we got about 500+ pictures. They were great fun to look at and some of them came out incredably(sp) well.

[Pat]

Tenny...run away. Just kidding :).
In addition to the above excellent advice I might add....In the time left before the wedding, get to know your equiptment flawlessly, your own and whatever lighting you might rent/buy. If renting, get it a couple of days before hand and practice. And you will need an assistant to help with the lighting, even if just to hold an extra strobe.. Practice, practice, practice. You don't want to be figuring things out during the ceremonies.
This might be the toughest part...no matter the pressure or how flustered you might get, keep a smile close by if not constantly on your face. A pleasant demeanor will get more cooperation than a cranky one. People tend to avoid crankiness so don't worry, be happy (at least on the outside).
http://digital-photography-school.com/wedding-photography-21-tips-for-for-amateur-wedding-photographers

[jerryph]

Tenny...run away.
Without trying to sound snarky, that is the best advice I can offer as well. :D If you are not able to confidently deliver good photos for a wedding, but are a good friend to the bride and groom, refuse to do it, and even better, help them by assisting them find a good pro within their budget.

I just recently completed my very very first wedding as the main solo photographer. It was stressful as hell, it was nerve wracking, there was nearly no time to even go to the toilet, I ran around like a chicken without a head for 14 hours. I did not have time to even get one full meal in that time period (I had half my meal before they carried it away as I was always shooting!) but I did lose about 5 pounds weight in that 14 hours, even after drinking about 8 bottles of water in that time period!

Sound like an experience you are ready for? Let me add to it a little something...

I've been studying and mentoring with one of the best wedding photographers in my area for the last *2* years starting as an assistant and 2nd shooter. I have easily over $12,000US in equipment or more. My cameras (plural) are pro quality, my lenses are pro quality and my lighting is pro quality... and I *know* how to use all of it at the professional caliber level.

There were still moments that I lost the flow and made several stupid mistakes. Thank God nothing serious, because I know how important and unrepeatable a wedding is.

Now, if you tell me that you have the right equipment for the job (that means a pro level camera that can give you clean ISO 1600 shots whether you use it or not), that you have good glass (that means having a range of lenses from 20mm to 200mm and nothing slower than F/2.8... I have 7 lenses, nothing slower than F/2.8, two that are F/1.4 and a 20mm F/1.8 and have focal ranges from 15mm to 200mm all covered. My camera can give me clan ISO 3200 shots, and I have practiced long and hard at nailing the exposures in dark churches and dark reception halls). I would say that you are about 25% ready to do a wedding properly.

You see... this is part of what it takes to do a wedding properly, IMHO... experience, time and knowledge. Anyone can lift any camera and press the shutter 3,000 times in a 14 hour period... but how ready are you to get all the important moments crystal clear with equipment that will never let you down?

How many practice photos did you take? Before even starting to mentor, I took 10,000 wedding oriented specific practice shots, that was besides the normal playing around I did playing with the strobist club here in Montreal (another easy 10,000 shots there alone per year). I did at least 20 weddings over a 2 year period as an assistant and mentor. Add an easy 25,000 photos for that.

Even with all that, I was stressed, worried and always on the alert. I did a pretty good job, the clients were ecstatic, but wow... **never** underestimate what it takes to do a good wedding the way it is supposed to be done.

I would want to discourage weak amateur photographers from doing any weddings simply because they are the couple's most important time in their life, and deserve to get the best quality photos they deserve. It is without doubt the most challenging aspect of all of photography where your skills should include:

- an experienced and accomplished professional photographer
- the expertise of a psychologist
- the abilities of a customer service expert
- the abilities of an accomplished public speaker
- the abilities of a graphics design expert
- the creativity of Leonardo DaVinci
- the abilities of an IT technician
- and likely a hundred other skills that I cannot recall off-hand

----------------------------------------

Now... all that said, there are people who get married who could NOT care less about photography. Indeed, I used to be one of them. When I got married, I refused to even pay $100 for a photographer, thinking it was better to not even have one there than need to pay for it.

Today, I regret that so much it is not possible. In my research so far, *every* couple that I spoke with that did the same, feels the same I do today. Massive regrets.

People spend thousands on cakes, thousands on booze and what do they have from it after the wedding? NOTHING. But they will complain if they have to pay someone to work their asses off for a whole day to give them images that will last them their lifetimes and will be passed down the generations to their children and children's children.

I take weddings very seriously. Even with what it does to me physically and mentally, I love doing them and in fact have will have turned pro as of this September.

I know this is all a jumble of thoughts, but, well, maybe one day I will write out a blog and when people ask this question again (and trust me, they will), maybe they will get a batter idea of what it takes to do a wedding RIGHT. :)

[jerryph]

TO more directly answer your questions:


This is an Indonesian wedding:
1. The wedding will be held indoor.
Flashes. Anything from 2 to 5 flashes, preferably OFF camera flash to light larger groups. Do not use ON camera flash as everyone will have the typical red DEMON eyes, and that just looks so amateur, its not even funny. Do not even think about using the IN camera flash... it is weak, nondirectional and further promotes more red eye.


2. There will be a religion's wedding ceremony in the building.
Shoot in RAW. Mixing flashes and fluorescent lights makes balancing white balance a nightmare.

3. There will be a reception party
If they are on the stage and you are not, and they are higher than you, the shots come out all skewed. Stand on a ladder and get the shots you need from that vantage point. Shooting upwards adds some real funky distortion to each photo.

4. There will be picture sessions (on the stage) of the guest and families with the bride and the groom, and the pictures of the bride and the groom themselves as well.
Meh. I would get them in a more interesting location other than a boring stage. Sure, do the stage shots to make them happy, but take them to a more interesting location to make them ecstatic!

I will be accompanied by another amateur photographer too:o to share the job.
I do not like "competing" with other photographers for prime positions. Also, if more than 1 person is shooting a scene, the people do not know where to look, you or someone else.


- I use a 105mm macro for the detail and ring shots.

- I use a 45mm Tilt-Shift F/2.8, 50mm F/1.4, 85mm F/1.4,70-200 F/2.8, 20mm F/1.8 and 15mm fisheye for the ceremony. If it is a tight and space limited location, I use a 24-70 F/2.8.

- I use the 45mm Tilt-Shift F/2.8, 50mm F/1.4, 85mm F/1.4, 70-200mm F/2.8 for the formals depending on the room. I also setup a multi-flash arrangement to nicely light the subject(s).

- I use a multi-flash setup at the reception and vary lenses mostly between the 50mm F/1.4 and the 20mm F/1.8.

There is NO one setting that works everywhere. 90% of the time I am in full manual mode and closely control the output for consistency. Even with the camera almost always in manual, I change between 4 different metering and focusing modes to make sure I get the shot.

My flashes are *always* in 100% full manual mode. I remotely trigger them via Pocket Wizards, which are the industry standard.

Make sure you have enough batteries for several thousand photos and enough storage media for the same. It goes to say that you should have a backup camera in case something goes wrong... and this does happen more often than we like to admit, even with professional equipment.

There is a reason that there are hundreds of books out there on lighting, general photography, strobism and weddings out there... there is a TON of stuff that one should know before doing these events. ;)

[mingkywingky]

Oh My God....!!! I definitely will run away and cry:eek:
When my sister asked me to be the photographer of her daughter's wedding, I was like... who? me? I haven't even finished my course!:eek: But then she says that they won't mind and they will accept whatever the results are. In my mind, I don't think they really mean it, they just don't have a choice since the can't afford to hire a pro. Like what Jerry said, I'm too, afraid that they will regret it later, and I'm sure they will... if they insist me to be the main photographer of the big occasion. I don't even have any qualification of skill that Jerry mentioned above! not even 10% (I'm flattered by the way that Jerry says I was 25% ready :D)

Thank you so much everybody for giving me a very good advice, thank you Shirley for attention and for sharing your experience as an amateur wedding photographer (I'm more amateur than you). Thank you Joseph for your kind attention and for the good idea of having guests taking the pictures. I will tell my sister about it. You're right, Jerry is very good. Really good...! Thank you Sandy for the great advice. Thank you Pat for your advice and the link, I definitely need lots of practice, practice,practice.
Special thanks to Jerry for his very kind attention and for giving me all the valuable advices of the wedding's photo shoot and for sharing your great experiences. Even that you disagreed, you still gave me the answers of all my questions.

Again, thank you so much everyone for opening my eyes and my mind. Your kind attentions mean a lot to me. I really appreciate it. I'm glad that I'm in the forum.
Now.. I need another advice: How do I tell my sister and my niece that I refuse the job??:D:D kidding...!! You've already told me how.

Best Regards,
Tenny:)
Canon Rebel T1i

[Kaye]

Good luck Tenny telling your friends. After having read all the above by the experts, you will know what to say.

I did not want to respond immediately and did await the more experienced "wedding" members like Jerry to reply... and I knew what he would say.
I am so glad you have carefully listened to what he had to say.

Friends that are not into photography do not at all understand.. or realise the equipment and technology needs required to make a success of a huge day like a wedding.
I just did some shots of a 60th b/day party, (with the intention to give them some shots in a small album later).

They have not asked me to do this, but I just wanted to try to get some nice shots to print and put in a little album for my friend as a little extra gift for her birthday. (NO PRESSURE ON ME, AND I CAN HAVE FUN TAKING SHOTS FOR THE NIGHT. Great way to practice and get experience in my opinion.
BUT, what a hectic night. People management is probably the hardest problem of any photographer. And I have not done much night photography.

I was a little disappointed in my shots on the night, but have managed to get a few nice shots from it... so I am happy with my outcome with no PRESSURE.

Good luck Tenny and wise choice.

[coffee]

I have one idea for you Tenny, the best of both worlds for all concerned.

First off, my style of portrait photography lean to the candid, or casual side. I always thought that candid images show more natural emotion than posed shots.

Here's the idea: If your friend still won't put a hire a pro after all you tell her, tell her you would be glad to take candid photo's of the day. Nothing structured. You can then spend the day loving your photography, and I'm sure taking very nice shots that she will be very grateful for. These images can consist of the wedding parties getting ready for the day, taking images of the venue/tables/flowers/cake/gift table/wedding license signing/reception-skies the limit. Basically everything the pro might do less the formals, and you will take what you want when you want. No pressure, no organizing. I bet your images will be a huge hit.

One other thought. Let's say after trying to convince your friend to hire a pro, and she simply refuses. OK, now there will be no one to do the formals, no one that has your knowledge of photography. At this point what would you have to lose by stepping in. Nothing, so why NOT do it. Make sure you keep us updated :)

[mingkywingky]

Thank you for your kind attention Kaye and thank you for sharing your experience, I was planning to make a photobook too. I'm grateful to have lots of good advices from all gurus here. I might feel very embarrassed for being so naive and stupid, but that's all right for me. I'll just take the positive side of all of this, we all get a very valuable lessons.

Thank you so much for the idea Joseph, you're so thoughtful. I was thinking the same thing. Taking candid photos of during the wedding would be great. I had a nice sleep last night, I guess that all the pressures are gone, well except for the telling part. I'm going to speak to them today. With all those reasons, I'm sure they will understand. I will do your advice of helping them looking for the affordable wedding photographer, even though we don't have much time anymore. I shouldn't have accepted the offer at the first place. They assured me that they would accept all of the consequences, so I thought.. Okay, why not..? I've been browsing all kind information for the wedding from the internet, and been practicing lots of indoor shoots. Still that won't be enough. I couldn't imagine what would happen, because I've been avoiding to even think about that. Que sera sera... (so naive!:D:o)

Again, thank you so much for everybody whose so caring and helpful. I'm sorry if I couldn't express myself as I should, due to my limitation of English.:o

Tenny:)

[coffee]

Speaking of photo albums, the last two wedding I attended for friends and family, where I was the second photographer, I made them each a special gift. Before each wedding I had a scrapbooker friend make up a custom photo album specifically made for each couple with everything except the images. Then, that evening after the event was over, I spent the majority of the night and next morning editing and organizing the images and planning what image would go where in the album. Then the next morning I had them processed at one of many 1 hour processing locations. Placed the images in, wrapped it up, and presented it to each couple that morning at the gift opening.

Can you image having your very first wedding album the very next morning of the wedding, long before the fog of the previous day has wore off. It was the coolest thing in the world when they are opening up this gift thinking it was just an empty wedding album, turning the first page and realizing it was full of memories of the previous day. You bet, that was a hell of a lot of work, and got little to no sleep, but it didn't fail to make each couple cry at the touching disbelief that someone could have done this. It was also the hit of the gift opening as it got passed around to everyone there. Talking with the couples after the wedding, they both said the same thing; They got lots of wonderful and thoughtful gift, but the one I gave them meant the most. And that they were taking their first wedding album on their honeymoon to show everyone.

So if you are up for a project, and have a wedding to attend soon for someone special, present this gift to them. You won't believe the emotions it will create.

[jerryph]

Great idea, Joeseph, but in terms of seeing pics of the day, I think my mentor has you beat on one aspect... he presents a slideshow of photos taken the previous 8-10 hours of the:
- groom getting ready
- bride getting ready
- church shots
- formals taken after the church

...usually just while they are having desert!

He then has a very fast laptop and using Lightroom, while eating furiously makes a 15-20 minute slideshow, while I cover any shots that need to be done like the couple kissing and speeches... and then he projects them to a big HD screen using a powerful projector. The last wedding where we were in a tent, the inside of the tent ceiling was not too high but very nicely angled and from anywhere in the tent, it was amazing to see a 40 foot wide slideshow... it literally stopped the party... lol

We always get a standing ovation after the slideshow, which is loosely synced to music that the DJ plays.

The couple then gets this slideshow as part of their package on a DVD apart from the photos.

It is a great idea, but for me, I do not think I would do that this year because of the tremendous stress it places on the photographer plus the added costs of a very strong laptop, high-end projector and screen.

...but what an effect it has!

[mingkywingky]

WOW...I'm speechless...!All those brilliant ideas from a very creative persons who don't mind working really hard to create the amazing things.

Joseph, you're so thoughtful and so caring. They're very lucky to have you as their friend. I can imagine the look on their faces while receiving those wonderful gifts.

I'm also imagining myself seeing that 40 feet wide slide show... wow.. I would also give Jerry and his friend a long standing ovation.

Thank you very much for sharing.:)


Tenny:)